Sunday, August 29, 2010

People I want to punch in the face (continued)

The Feminist Breeder has two boys. She's pregnant with #3. One recent morning, her son knocked her right between the eyes (accidentally). And she blogged that she - at that exact moment - had a "pure, unadulterated hatred" toward him.

Too bad her other son couldn't punch her in the face for me too.

htp://thefeministbreeder.com/darkness-falls-across-the-land

***I really wouldn't punch anyone in the face. This is just an ongoing series featuring "JAMS" that sometimes need to know that a punch in the face can be an awakening.***

90 comments:

Nicole said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Nicole said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Sunny said...

I love it! LOL!

Kate said...

I think she was just giving the readers an honest take on the highs and lows of mamahood. I'm sure many moms have been there before. It's not good; it's not bad; it's just real.

Michelle said...

I can see where you're coming from Kate, I have a two-and-a-half-year-old daughter myself, but I'm 100 percent sure that I've never hated her before.

SquirrelyMama said...

I've been reading The Feminist Breeder for a while now, and I think the point of her post wasn't about her children at all, but about how her pregnancy hormones were making her overreact to everything that happened to her. She is even sorry for that momentary hate-filled thought. I know that my pregnancy hormones made me VERY nutty!

As far as home birth goes, I think it's a decision that every person needs to make for themselves. There are drawbacks to hospital births that there aren't for home births.

However, I do see where you're coming from, I just hope that you are taking everything written online with a grain of salt.

Anonymous said...

Well I guess not everyone can be fucking perfect like you!

Blair said...

What in the world was the point of this? Very mean-spirited.

Brooke said...

Isn't motherhood about supporting each other? I HIGHLY doubt The Feminist Breeder really wanted to hit anybody, ever. It's such a shame that moms blame each other for things....whether it was a crazy hormone thing or the extremely personal decision to birth your child in the privacy and comfort of your own home.

Brittany said...

wow...you missed the whole context of that one blog. It wasn't about how she hated her children or how she wanted them gone or anything that extreme. She wrote a real blog about real things that happen and how pregnancy hormones make you a bit nutty at times. If you are a mom and you say you have never had a bad day whern you kind think holy crp why did I have kids than you are a liar plain and simple. To post about TFB with a title 'people i want to punch in the face' shows me that yes you too have probably had moments where you just wanna do something like punch somebody in the face.

As for the homebirth, it is the right of any woman with a normal healthy pregnancy to birth where and how she wants not to bend over and take it from doctors and insurance companies to form in a good line like sheep leading to the slaughter. If it's not for you than it's not for you but don't knock homebirths or the women who have them just because it's not your cup of tea.

nobody is pefrect if you think you are you are so full of bullshit.

SchuckFamily said...

Here was my response to TFBs post. I read, and respect her, for her honesty.

"Wow. I had been meaning to thank you for posting that. I felt like I could have written your post myself. Sometimes I get so down, and things are SO hard that I find myself beating myself up, feeling like a failure, feeling like a bad mom, etc. Reading an honest post like yours helps those of us who find parenting more difficult that we could have dreamed, well, not alone, human and even hopeful. I have always felt that many women are afraid to speak honestly about parenting for fear of being judged when in reality it leaves many of us feeling isolated and guilty."

ProChoiceGal said...

I'm so very sorry that not everyone can be perfect 100% of the time. I'm so very sorry that some people like to be *honest* about the ups and downs of parenthood, because, you know, even as a childless person I know that it's not all ups, there are downs.

And, Michelle, I'm so very sorry that you're apparently too lazy and/or self serving to actually do some real research about homebirth before judging other women.

Yeah. So sorry.

Anonymous said...

I think motherhood is rife with so many ups and downs and days when, yes, we hate our jobs that I'm baffled why we don't support each other. I have yet to meet a mom who hasn't had split-seconds of anger/hatred. In fact, I remember one magazine editor who wrote her editorial about the day she screamed at her five-year-old son that she hated him -- undeniably the lowest point in her motherhood trajectory. But what a relief to have someone I respected admit that some days the job just really, really sucks. My three kids are an absolute privilege to have in my life. And I consider myself extraordinarily blessed. But I would be a liar if I didn't acknowledge that sometimes they bring out the very worst in me.
The thing is, that feeling can be mitigated by another mother acknowledging that it's a tough job. And exacerbated by another mother passing judgement.

Anonymous said...

Isn't the point of a blog to be honest and discuss your feelings? Why shouldn't she be able to "hate" her son momentarily in the throws of child inflicted pain?

Spare me the comments on what a blessing a child is. Good mothers know this. No human or relationship is perfect.

As for a home birth, every woman should be able to make a decision based on what is best for them. During the course of labour, if a midwife feels that care should be transferred to a hospital, then it is. Things just don't suddenly go wrong in labour, the signs start early and give ample warning.

Michelle- why are you so offended that she deleted your comment? Is that not her right being the moderator of her blog? What a lousy attitude you have.

Ericka, Jeff & Brody said...

dont take her words out of context either; if you continue reading, she talks about HER childhood, HER bad experiences with her mother, and all of that. this isnt about how she was hating her own kid, it was about how what she felt reflected how her experience with her mother has truly affected her life to her core.

and if you think your mother hasnt affected you to the core, you are dead wrong.

have some compassion. when your kid nails you in the face with his head, you might have some feelings too. we all have them. my brother (11 years younger) used to do that to us when he was a baby as well, and it was pure torture. you have no idea. it HURTS. and then you feel bad for yelling because it hurts the baby too.

dont take one line and rip someone a new butthole just because you didnt like it; you didnt even understand it.

Julisuz said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ericka, Jeff & Brody said...

and besides all that, the normal reaction to that in "the world's view" would be to spank that kid and punish him.

you dont see her doing any of that do you.
at least she has enough love, self control, and respect to control herself and her reaction to it, and not harm her son in the process.

natalie said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Maegan said...

Good Lord...whatever you're taking, I'd like some. I'm absolutely thrilled you've never once felt like you could send the little monsters off to keep from tieing them to each other & heaving them over the nearest bridge.

Nicole...not having a child, is not an excuse to be a douchehole about how people can initially want to react to seriously painful moments. Many women in labor, who have gotten knocked up by their loving, supportive, wonderful husbands have wanted their husbands dead as those labor pains kick in. Should we all hold that in simply b/c we should be grateful to have a husband...b/c some person somewhere does NOT have a husband & we should count our blessings??

I'll lend you both of my kids & let them punch you till the skin ruptures. Hell, if you want to be punched in the face so bad...I'm kinda handy. ;)

Jamie said...

Do you nit have anything better to do than to write a blog entry about someone else's blog entry? Way to let her own your day.

Anonymous said...

So, if TFB can write whatever she wants, why can't this blogger write whatever she wants?

If it's ok that TFB had a moment of anger, why can't this blogger have a moment of anger?

I'm all about moms supporting moms, but this is gang warfare of here - TFB's army is out in force tonight! Chill out, ladies - it's just a blog.

Bryn said...

Sounds like you're in a lot of pain, just as The Feminist Breeder probably was. I think she shared her story of depression and desperation(and feeling badly about what happened) to confess, relate, process...whatever the reason was it was for the higher good. You on the other hand are just being mean. I won't judge you for it though, as I said before you are probably hurting too. If you had simply sent her a message saying something like "be grateful for your babies, you are lucky", I'm sure she would have responded positively, and maybe you could have helped her through that "moment". Instead you made the poor and cowardly decision to spread hate about another mother. It's not funny and I hope no one ever does it to you.

Heather said...

I'm so sorry I stumbled across your blog. What a bunch of mean-spirited, ignorant drivel.

Anonymous said...

Considering the title of your post and the attack within it, your criticism is kind of funny.

Also? People have home births because they ARE better for the baby. Believe it or not, getting poked and prodded and whisked away from mother is not ideal.

Teresa said...

Seriously ladies?!?!? Back off.

Michelle is just as entitled to express her feelings as TFB. I think both women are courageous for sharing them with us regardless of how raw, gut-wrenching, embarrassing, happy, (insert any other feeling here) they may be.

Anonymous said...

Not to mention the fact that you pretty much distorted the story, and only took the part you wanted to share about. Someone else hit the nail right on the head - the post was more about the stress that sometimes goes with motherhood, and the stress from pregnancy hormones. This woman loves her children VERY much, more than you could imagine, and there are definitely counters to the ups that come with parenthood.

Anonymous said...

[Same poster] And many of you who have posted in opposition of home births need to read a little bit of history on pregnancy and childbirth. Births have only taken place in hospitals for the past couple hundred - out of several billion - years. And almost ALWAYS - unless the pregnancy is high-risk - the birth turns out better at home. Wouldn't know unless you've tried it, though. My sister had 8 kids at home w no complications; I went to the hospital with my first an ended up with a cesarean. That should tell ya something....

Anonymous said...

Mom to 4

as a mom I am glad people are candid and share the highs and lows. I have twin 13 year olds and two younger children. I can say that I have had those moments. I know what it feel like to have lost a child and struggle to keep those little ones on earth with us BUT there are moments when you are at the end of your rope. I have looked at my beautiful blessing and wondered how I could hide the fact that I wanted to run away from them at times...that's life

Michelle said...

One particular, bold-faced sentence in Gina's blog upset me. It shook me. This is how I responded. Forgive me if I'm not in a proper state of mind after Sawyer died.

Anonymous said...

Some of you need to show this blogger the same compassion you showed TFB when she wrote the post in question. This kind of ganging-up on someone who is obviously grieving the loss of her baby is pretty hateful.

Amy said...

Michelle, I've never read your blog before, and I am so terribly sorry for your loss and your pain. Please accept my sincerest condolences.

Obviously her post struck a raw nerve with you, and I'm sorry that happened. I assure you, though, that the way you took it was not the way she meant it. If you're going to leave this post up, I think you have the responsibility to go back and read her post again through a different lens - maybe the lens of someone who is in pain and is struggling with the demands of pregnancy and mothering young children, instead of the lens of someone who just lost a beloved son.

You have my compassion, as does TFB who is dealing with a lot herself, right now. As mothers, I think we are at our best when we support each other. We're all fighting our own private battles. We choose whether or not we fight alone.

Anonymous said...

I think it's awful that you would choose to attack a mom who simply shared how horrible of a day she was having. I've been a parent for 21 years now- every one has days like that & if you claim you haven't you're lying to yourself.

Anonymous said...

Everyone of you that posted a mean spirited comment is a hipocryte. Do any of you know what Michelle has gone through? Probably not. Maybe you should do your research on here before you jump down her throat and maybe gain some perspective on why she had the reaction she had. If you can honestly say that if you were in Michelle's position and wouldn't have an adverse reaction to TFB's post, then congratulations. I think most people, however, can understand what Michelle is going through and can understand why she posted what she did. If were here to support all mommys, shouldn't we support Michelle too????

Anonymous said...

I Read TFB A lot I really enjoy how real she is and I am so sorry you are hurting.I doubt I can even imagine what you are going through but I have been through severe postpartum psychosis with panic attacks and hallucinations to boot. It is scary and posts like this even in a moment of anger and pain are the reason a lot of women just like me are terrified to ask for help. Hell I am still embarrassed to admit it YES I the CRUNCHY absolutely NEVER CIO person ended up at least half a dozen times letting both my children cio while I sat in the shower sobbing so hard I couldn't breathe breastfeeding even while trying vitamins to slow the 40 plus lb weight loss. trying all the while to appear as normal as possible because someone might think I was a terrible person if they knew how crazy this precious gift I had was making me. I was eventually hospitalized the first time around I started meds almost immediately , I want another baby so badly I ache but I am so scared of that awful shameful secret that I can't even share with my closest friends because the one time I did the first question out of the persons mouth was OMG how could you feel that way? I don't know and I hate it but I can't help it and it hurts so badly. Please remember that. You are suffering but lots of mothers suffer some out loud some in silence but you don't always know who they are just by there looks or words.

Anonymous said...

She was way off the mark. I cannot relate to most of her blogs!

Anonymous said...

I've had some bad days as a mother (and I mean REALLY bad days), but never, ever, EVER would I refer to my child as a "little fu**er" and even insinuate that I hated him! I don't know what's more sick - the original disgusting words or the abundance of women who have "been there" as if it's some motherly right of passage to feel hatred and vulgar thoughts toward your children (no matter what the motivation!). Women who have never done so are not "lying to themselves" - they're being loving mothers and practicing patience and self control in front of little eyes and ears.

I had no intention of sharing my opinion on the matter, but the fact that this has become a pissing contest leaves me a little peeved. Michelle, the only thing you did "wrong" was assume your readers shared your views of decency in parenting. I'm sure my comment will soon be lost in the pile of hate-mail from the onslaught of visitors (most of whom were cleverly led here by TFB herself - gotta have backup you know!). Just know that you're not nearly as alone as these women are trying to make you feel. It's okay to not hate your kids. :)

Maria Melee said...

This was obviously written from a foundation of pain. I'm really disappointed in the people bashing you. Get a grip and move on, folks. This mama is hurting.

mom2nji said...

I honestly don't know the whole story, so I wont judge one way or the other. Having lost a baby to still birth and then having 5 miscarriages, I KNOW all too well how raw your feelings are right now.
I know ho hearing people bitch about their healthy ALIVE kids feels like a knife to the heart.
But what I had to learn was, I can't make anyone feel my pain.
People have bad days. Moms get angry, hormonal, and say things they dont mean. Lets not do it to each other.

Anonymous said...

One thing's for sure. Her tantrum is escalating as she realizes that she's eating her words. Should we hold our breath for an apology? Probably not, but the squirming sure is satisfying to watch (and she seems pretty darn sure that you're on your way to her house to hit her). Sometimes people just need to own what they say and cut the BS.

BeautifulWreck said...

I am very sorry for your loss. I am also sorry that people have come here and attacked you. When bloggers write things like TFB did, they need to know they are going to get criticism from it and move on from it.
I hate that you are being raked over the coals for sharing your feelings, wrong or not.

Annie Y said...

I am so sorry for your loss. I cannot even begin to imagine what you are going through. I can totally understand why TFB's post upset you as it did, there are parts of it that upset me too given my most recent blog post. I'm sorry that you have fallen victim to the pure rudeness of some of the people within this community, just remember, you are stronger then them and just continue to write what you feel, this is your blog and you have EVERY right to agree or disagree with whoever you wish.
You are in my thoughts.

Alan said...

Anonymous wrote: "I think motherhood is rife with so many ups and downs and days when, yes, we hate our jobs that I'm baffled why we don't support each other. I have yet to meet a mom who hasn't had split-seconds of anger/hatred."

But Anonymous, you just admitted this anonymously. That's perfectly appropriate. TFB's blog is associated with her real name. Her kids are going to grow up and be able to read it (even if she deletes it, references to this incident are all over the Web now). How do you think that is going to feel?

I've never felt anything like "hatred" for any of my kids. I have felt anger; but I think it's very important to hide that anger from them. It is much scarier, with much deeper and longer lasting hurt, for a child to feel anger from a parent than for an adult to feel it from another adult (or a child from a child).

As for homebirth, the OP sounds pretty ignorant. I am a big supporter of midwifery and homebirth, just FTR.

Colleen The Doula said...

This is gonna get me trampled... but here goes nothing.

Michelle is an old friend of mine. She recently came to me for birth classes before the premature birth and untimely death of her son Sawyer. This was just under two months ago.

I've known Michelle since before my boobs came in, and TFB is a professional acquaintance whom I have briefly met once or twice, and had limited interactions with. I do not know her well, but I read both women's blogs.

It's hard for me not to take sides here-- I'm sort of hard-wired to side with Michelle, both because she is the underdog here (who is getting a very unnecessary beating), and because the context of her words is MUCH MORE important than the words themselves. For some reason, though, no one seems to be paying attention to this.

continued..

Colleen The Doula said...

A huge chunk of my initial post is missing.... ugh! Up all night and still not done!!

Let's be fair. TFB gets to have her bad days and mommy-melt downs,and Michelle does, too. They don't look the same, but we're looking one for each of them, and I don't think that any ONE of us is so infinitely perfect that we have the right to judge or attack EITHER of these women for their respective purges/breakdowns/rants/meltdowns.

I need to make it clear that Infant loss is NOT something you can understand until it's happened to you. No matter how close you are to this kind of loss, or how many times, this is the biggest, most crippling grief there is. It takes a lifetime to process, and you're never 'done' or 'over it. People aren't always themselves in their darker moments, especially when the pain is so fresh.

Sometimes grief strips people down so far, that they need to find themselves all over again as part of the healing process-- and the person they find in the end is not the same as the one that began this process. To a grieving mother, some things are sacred. And when someone unknowingly violates one of those things, you get triggered (just like with the PTSD that TFB and I are both so familiar with), and you get a major meltdown, like this one.

continued

Colleen The Doula said...

And when you're a public figure like TFB, you get hate mail. Some of it looks like this, and some of it looks different. TFB sometimes posts her hate mail, and gets it for ALL KINDS OF STUFF. I mean, people cam tale offense at just about anything... and sadly, thisis the price of fame. If many people love you, seemingly, just as manyu will hate you. This is the reality of having a blog like TFB's,and I don't think that's a secret.

But I want to take a moment and reframe this blog post. Hate mail has to be SENT to the person it speaks to in order to have an intent to harm, and this was posted on a private blog and NOT send directly to TFB. So any threat of violence perceived by TFB, was really not very serious, as it showed no intent. Michelle merely lashed out at something that triggered her on TFB's blog, and did so in the safety of her own little blog, by using the same verbiage that TFB was using towards her own children. She made her disdain known, as well as her pain, by using TFB's words in a different way. Was this nice? no. Was it noble? no. Was it called for? no... but did she need to purge? yes. Did she deserve to be spammed by almost 50 TFB fans for venting something that triggered her private grief? NO.

Perhaps Michelle would have deleted this post when her grief passed... we can't know for sure. But I DO KNOW that she didn't post her own URL or blog address on twitter because she didn't want to bring attention to this. She knew it came out mean, and she knew it wasn't nice, but she needed to get it out anyway.

continued

Colleen The Doula said...

We'll never know what Michelle's real hopes with this purge post were, because when TFB found this, she wasted NO TIME enlisting the twitter troops to tell Michelle off, and teach her a lesson.

And because twitter is a fame/popularity contest, practically the whole blogosphere came to TFB's rescue.... only I don't think TFB needed rescuing, and Michelle certainly doesn't need ALL THIS HATE in her lap tonight, either. I would argue that TFB hardly EVER needs rescuing, as tough as she seems to be, which is another reason why I am so very bewildered by this response.

Emotions are wild, and dangerous things. Especially when they come from pregnant and grieving women. Why is it fair to give one of them a break, and not both? I forgive TFB her depressive-overwhlemed-cry all-day-long-breakdown, and I also forgive Michelle for her disrespectful but meek attempt at throwing around some angry words to cover up the hurt and loss she felt so acutely when she read TFB's post on her mommy angst. I appreciate and sympathize with the angst of both women here, and I find it sad that so many posters on here are calling for 'mothers supporting mothers', when they are themselves so quick to jump on the mommy-bashing bandwagon when that mommy has crossed TFB.

I don't really understand the shock and surprise people experience when they put such personal material out there for anyone to read, and people don't agree. The readers may even strongly disagree, take offense, or engage in a heated debate on the subject. Isn't this the risk you take when you publicly blog about moments of vulnerability in your life?

continued

Colleen The Doula said...

I don't think TFB is naive enough to think that she's only going to get valentines and love letters when she writes about things like this, so what is all this REALLY about?

It seems to me that judgment by others is an inevitable part of intimate blogging turf. I just don't see how it can be avoided.... and I think TFB is totally smart enough to get that... which is why I don't understand why she didn't read this post, see it as the meaningless painful backlash that it is from a mother who is in too much pain to think straight, and let it roll off her back.

I'll admit, I'm a little disappointed in TFB's reaction. I had higher expectations. No, I'm not asking her to endure threats to her person, but seriously, read this post. There is no real threat here,and with a little further reading, the context would have been clear, and the issue should have ended then. Perhaps a short exchange through private messages was in order to clear this up, but this flamewar was totally uncalled for.

THIS is why I censor what I write. Maybe TFB is braver than I am, or tougher, but I don't need people judging my vulnerable moments, so I keep them OFF the public channels. Clearly, she knows this kind of thing is bound to happen-- she blogs about her hate mail, after all. So it is safe to assume TFB has a thick skin, and can take it, right?

Colleen The Doula said...

But then TFB finds this little rant blog from a broken momma, and is upset by it... when does it become appropriate to rowdy up the twitter TFB fanclub for a giant flood of negative attention toward a mother who lost her only son just two short months ago?

Seriously guys, we need to let TFB and Michelle hash this one out. It's not about us, and it's NOT a popularity contest.

I'm pretty lost as to why TFB felt the need to post this on Twitter to get everyone all riled up and fighting on her behalf. She called out the dogs tonight, and I don't think she needed to. And I don't know why.
NO, I don't think people should have to endure threats no matter what their opinions are, but here we can see that one mother lashed out, and 41 other mothers retaliated...and with much sharper tongues. And again, doesn't TFB anticipate controversy with posts like that one?

I find it hard to believe this is the worst kind of thing she's gotten. I also find it hard to believe that this REALLY hurt her feelings badly enough that all of twitter needed to be involved, and come to her defense. If there is one thing I'm sure of about TFB, it's that she can take care of herself, and that all the rest of this was unnecessary, and only served to beat down a mother who can't really get much lower. How does that feel as an answer toall of your cries for 'supporting other mothers'?

TFB is not so naive, she knew something like this was out there, and expected to find it. This is why she trolls the internet for her name, looking for what people have to think and say about what she puts up. And that's okay. It's okay to accept the risk of putting yourself out there, knowing that you'll get some dissent, and also knowing that you'll need to go find it and read it.

Colleen The Doula said...

I simply cannot understand why the TFB fanboy army is on this little blog about a woman's acute grief. I can't believe they're telling her she's an awful hypocrite, and 'we're oh so sorry we're not perfect enough for you', and all sorts of nasty degrading things... this is NOT an appropriate response to the situation.

And I LOVE how almost everyone posted ANONYMOUSLY, so they can be as mean as they want to be, and not have to feel bad later. Nothing like not having to take credit, or heat over your own words-- it really frees you up to be meaner than you would EVER be in real life. That's cowardice.

And I wonder, with so many comments deleted, which ones were taken down from the guilt or shame that was realized when more of Michelle's blog was read. When people learned that this is the blog of a woman who lost a child, they seem to have felt less strongly about the TFB bashing. Why the need to delete your comments if you're standing on high ground?

Colleen The Doula said...

Michelle used the same language TFB used, and turned around against her. It was a TRIGGER for her, and having read the post, it's clear to me that it was NOT truly threatening to TFB at all. Was it disrespectful? Yes it was. Was it mean? Yes it was. Would she post something like this NORMALLY? NO!

She should not have been mean to TFB, but she is not in a good place... and while a few of you can see that, most of you haven't looked, and are beating her up TOO HARSHLY. Is THIS how we support other moms?? Because these posts aren't exactly leading by any example I would like to follow.

I KNOW the horrible motherhood moments TFB is referencing in her post. I KNOW we're not always SO HAPPY to be mom when our kids pee on our beds, break our glasses, and bash our faces in (accidentally or not). But I would never be so naive to think that posting these things on the internet would win me EVERYONE's affection. Nor would I be surprised if someone thought badly of me for having them-- this is the risk you take when you lay vulnerable in a public forum. And sometimes, the responsibility to doing this, is holding your head high, knowing who you are and that you do your best. And then walking on WITHOUT the need to have dramatic squabbles,or lash back. After all, if you're entitled to post it, and it's there for everyone to read, they're entitled to have an opinion on it. It's a gutsy lifestyle, but I think TFB is made of the right stuff to pull it off.

To live this way with grace would mean to refrain from calling in reinforcements to defend you against your dissenters for judging a private moment in your life, that you made so easy for them to find. It would be to keep walking, chin up, knowing you're a better person for being brave.

Good night ladies. Michell, I am sorry about all this, I know it's the last thing you need, and I sincerely hope that you're okay. Call me tomorrow if you need to.

Colleen The Doula said...

I keep reading so many women here harping on and on about SUPPORTING OTHER MOTHERS... who here is supporting Michelle?? Isn't she a mother, too?? Is her breakdown less needed, or less important? No, she just doesn't have a super-blog with super-followers to fight this battle for her. This seems to me, to be a case of internet bullying. And again, I will state that I might be wrong, and remind you that Michelle is my friend, and I AM biased... but that's how this looks to me.

I would also like to note that Michelle doesn't demand PERFECTION in mothers, but she does want people to be grateful for what they have, because she's struggling with her empty arms right now, that are supposed to have a baby in them. I know she'd give anything to have been violently head-butted by her son today. But she wasn't, and she never will be. Maybe that's too cliche for you, but this cliche is every moment of her life right now, and all I ask is that you try to understand the depth of such pain, forgive her, and leave her be.

Maybe Michelle would have had a very bad as a result of said head butt-- but she would have had the chance to have a bad day with her son... and this is a chance she will never get. I ask that you reach into your hearts and sympathize with this woman, and her pain, and HOW it could have lead her to be triggered by the words of TFB, and forgive her for her socially inappropriate response.

Colleen The Doula said...

As you all flocked here, to defend your friend TFB, I am asking you to read a few more of Michelle's posts, and reconsider the depth of the injury you have caused to a mother who is already suffering so deeply, and let it go. Perhaps instead of demanding an apology from her, you should give one yourself, or at the very least.. take the high road, and DELETE YOUR COMMENTS.

I'm exhausted now, and need to stop typing, I am doubtful that my message is clear, and expect to return to more hissing and boos, but this drams is exhausting, and I do still hope, though weakly, that this will be over in less than an hour when dawn breaks.

ProChoiceGal said...

Michelle-

When I left my comment I didn't know that you had lost a son. I apologize. No, it doesn't make what you posted any better. No, it doesn't make it any less hateful. But it DOES make it much more understandable. I'm sorry for what you're going through, and I wish you nothing but the best in your future.

natalie said...

While my comment was mostly directed at your off hand reference to home birth, I have also removed it as it was not supportive.

I regret very much not reading more of your blog before commenting... I did not realized that you were grieving. My apologies, and I am so sorry for your loss.

Anonymous said...

What you people can't read from this blog of Michelle's is that she has been stirring up trouble on the internet for years. She would have wrote something like this regardless of her situation now. She likes to start drama online and act like she is perfect. She has the audacity to talk about home births being selfish when SHE is the selfish one. Going on TFB's blog and commenting saying her (michelle's) life is SO much harder than hers(TFB)just proves how shit always has to be about her. She is all about online drama. Always has and always will be... She has no life except an internet life of stirring shit up and acting like she is so much better than others. Is this bad timing to say considering what she has gone through the past few months? Probably... but she did it to herself with her actions. I don't feel bad for what is being said to her on here cause it was only time until she wrote something without thinking about the wrong person...
she is a troll

Michelle said...

@ anonymous - I'm not the one waging a war. You are.

Kristi said...

Ok seriously?? This feminist breeder chick complains in her blog that she can barely raise her head and is too miserable to feed her children, yet she has enough energy to sit at her computer and post blogs daily?? Give me a break. I'm all about giving sympathy to a mom feeling like crap, but this girl is a nutjob. I know what it's like to be pregnant, have another child to take care of and feel like hell. And yes, I've said the whole sarcastic comments like, "if you don't stop I'm gonna kill you." But calling them fuckers and not feeding them and saying I hate them? Get over yourself. Love you Michelle.

Mary Leonard said...

I'm not a doula, a midwife, feminist, or any type of so-called "expert" on the subject of childbirth and childrearing. What I am, is a mother. And it pains me to no end to watch people intentionally and maliciously take down someone who is so obviously hurting and grieving for the loss of their child. All I believe Michelle was trying to say, was that she would take a horrible morning with her son hitting her in the face ANY DAY rather than dealing with his death. There are times when we all (myself included) get angered and frustruated with our kids. It happens. But to say you hate your child, or to refer to them as little "f'ers" is out of line. Please do me a favor, and the next time you "hate" your child, imagine having to visit his grave instead like Michelle has to. That ought to put things into perspective for you. And as mothers and women as a whole, let's do ourselves a favor and support each other instead of tearing each other down. Love you Michelle.

MyCents said...

Good or bad, your writing conveys that you love the attention. Unfortunately, we are just enabling her by continuing to pay attention.

Heartbreak and loss are universal experiences. Using those experiences to gain more attention cheapens the message.

Anonymous said...

Edit: *to gain more attention for yourself

Mary Leonard said...

MyCents....how many of your children have you buried that you seem to have the expertise to call that kind of grief "universal"? And you can bet your ass that Michelle would trade in all the so-called "attention" in the world to be able to hold her son again. Please don't comment on something you obviously know nothing about.

MyCents said...

Mary, Mary.

It's obvious your post is full of nothing more than emotions and very little reasoning.

Are you telling the world that heartbreak and loss are felt the most by those who lose children? The way your post is written, this is exactly what you are saying.

That is a patently false statement.

And what of the great sadness and loss of those who can't have children? Or those that chose not to take the risk knowing full well they are too high risk for a healthy baby? Is their loss less?

To say that someone has no idea what heartbreak and loss feels like is "obviously" ridiculous.

And by the way, Michelle made this into a "public" issue by posting her comments all over the internet. If either of you dislike the fact that others have opinions on the matter, simply stop posting online.

Mary Leonard said...

"Are you telling the world that heartbreak and loss are felt the most by those who lose children? The way your post is written, this is exactly what you are saying."

Dear Nosense, what I was trying to say, is that it is a very different type of heartbreak and loss when you lose a child. Which no one could possibly understand or comprehend unless they have experienced it themselves. And I am one of those people that cannot carry a child. And you are right, my pain and loss is not less. But, again, it is a different type of pain, that only those in my situation could truly understand. I am a nurse, and I deal with death and dying on a daily basis. And one thing that I've learned is that everyone deals with grief differently. It seems to me that blogging has been very cathartic for Michelle, and who are you to judge and say she is doing this for attention? And if you truly believe that Michelle is doing this for the attention, then stop commenting and help control the "hype".

Anonymous said...

"Are you telling the world that heartbreak and loss are felt the most by those who lose children?"

Uh.....YES. Don't you dare compare LOSING a CHILD to anything else. EVER. Comparing fertility issues with a dead child, simply to win some kind of twisted debate? Shame on you. What a monstrous idea.

littleoldladyinashoe said...

I am sorry you have been attacked by some asshats.
I didn't read what the post said but telling your kids you hate them is a 2 year old thing to do and I think there is some much deeper seeded hate that she needs to deal with.

I can't say as I know how you feel, because my only loss was a miscarriage, but I would guess about a million times worse and I can't tell you how sorry I am that you are going through this.
Much Love and Many Hugs to your family

Formerly known as MyCents said...

Will do! Thanks for the suggestion!

Just for the record, my basis for my opinion comes from more than her recent posts regarding her son's loss. I am referring to her messages over the course of a few years.

Anonymous hit it on the head when she said Michelle loved starting internet hoopla. Brava!

SomeCents said...

"Comparing fertility issues with a dead child, simply to win some kind of twisted debate? Shame on you. What a monstrous idea."

I thought it pretty monstrous that anyone would go ahead with a pregnancy knowing the high risk to the baby. To each their own I suppose.

By the way, thank you for lessening my loss: your fertility "issues" are no match for a dead baby. Nice.

Mary Leonard said...

Nosense, you had originally left on a comment about how my comment was based purely on emotion. I would love to see yours. So far you have come off as quite heartless and cold. It also seems that you have been following Michelle on the internet for "years" as you put it. Hmm...for someone who obviously can't stand her, you sure give her a lot of attention--which as you so eloquently put it, just enables her. So why don't you just stop posting? Or maybe it's you that likes the attention?

NoSale said...

Your emotions seem to cloud your judgment.

I did not say I followed her over the years. You can access said posts from the menu.

I also didn't post comments on loss "simply to win a debate."

You can continue to twist my words if it suits your purposes. I will take your advice and leave. Absolutely nothing will come of trying to reason with emotionally charged, biased individuals.

Adeu.

Michelle said...

"I thought it pretty monstrous that anyone would go ahead with a pregnancy knowing the high risk to the baby. To each their own I suppose."

What risks are you talking about? We had no idea that Sawyer had such a severe and fatal heart defect until he was born. But, if you have known me for years, this little tidbit of information would be old news right?

I had never put my son in any danger. All he knew was pure love. And for that, I'm grateful. And the people that know and love our family are very much aware of how we were blindsided by our loss and by the news of the severe malformations of his heart.

Colleen The Doula said...

Dear my Cents:

Please take your ball and go home. You're spreading hate and it's ugly.

Michelle DID NOT EVEN KNOW THIS WAS GOING ON until there were over forty comments on her blog. She wasn't even INVOLVED in the Facebook drama that TFB was creating about her. And if you go back and look, you can see that TFB POSTED this URL on both twitter and Facebook, and asked everyone to respond. SHE is clearly creating this drama, Michelle has hardly commented in all the hundreds of posts this involves, and just wants to be left alone.

Go back and look, and I think you might realize your mistake. Michelle does not speak out AGAINST homebirth (where this came from, I have no idea), but has concerns about it's safety. AND SHE IS ENTITLED TO THEM as a mother whose life and first child was saved by the hospital. You may be a rabid supporter, but if you are, I'm sure you are aware that there are also people who don't support the movement, so why are you acting like this is the first time you've heard this? Why are you working out your frustration with a MOVEMENT of people by pegging it all on one passive woman? You can agree to disagree on that one, but the homebirth issue is NOT RELEVANT HERE, so STOP TALKING ABOUT IT.

And seriously... now we're comparing our grief to see who suffers more?? WHAT IS THIS COMPETITION ABOUT? What are you looking for here? Do you want me to tell you you're better than Michelle?? FINE, you're a flawless, wonderful, renaissance woman who all wise,and whose life burden is UNRIVALED. You are also omniscient WRT someone you've never met, and really have NOT been following on the internet for years. K, now are you satisfied??

Please take your angst somewhere else. I, for one, don't understand it, and can't stomach it any more.

snoopys_snooper said...

@Colleen: I'm pretty sure saying mothers who home birth are doing it for there own reasons and calling them self-ish for wanting to have one is speaking negatively of home birth. But then again that part of her blog is now missing... how convenient...along with other parts...

Also, you were the first one to compare what kind of griefs are worse than others... maybe you need to scroll up a little ways to see that...

And considering she has been on the internet posting crap all over the place for years makes it easy for just about anyone in this general will/cook county area to come across her keyboard diarrhea. For you to think someone is BS'ing you when they say they have seen her ignorant posts for years is naive... Kind of hard to avoid it considering sitting on the computer posting shit everywhere is all she does, whether she knows the people or not.

@Mary, Michelle's sister of course. If you think TFB was such a bad person for thinking the thoughts she thought, then maybe you should think the same of your sister considering once upon a time she thought...
http://michelleinwords.blogspot.com/2009/10/death-to-toddler.html

@Michelle... well, you put your son at risk the moment you decided to conceive again after being told you were high risk after Sadie... You want to call mothers who have home births selfish well one could say the same about you...


I really don't care if this seems harsh... You have given so many other people crap online before. I wish those who feel guilty about posting comments before or those feeling nothing but guilt for you knew all the internet bullying you have done in the past... Nice of you to delete part of the original blog to make yourself not look so bad and to delete comments you know are the truth.

Colleen The Doula said...

So, Snoopy Snooper, since I'm EXHAUSTED about arguing about all this, and your mind is all made up, can you do us a favor?

Why don't you tell us your name? Ya know, while you're being so 'honest'.

Even if you believe this is karmic retribution that Michelle somehow deserves, is it still really that important to have this showdown right after she lost her son?

Seems to me everyone is just enjoying kicking her while she is down and unable to fight back. I've never been a fan of mob vengeance.

Michelle is a journalist with a strong opinion. She doesn't shy away from a debate, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that. She has a strong media presence because she's a JOURNALIST, and I've never seen her bully anyone. But I suppose that is in the eyes of the beholder.


And I have read and re-read my posts... I've been reading them ALL NIGHT LONG. I've said my piece. I don't know why everyone acts so childishly and attacks one anther ad nauseum like this all the time. This is why I refrain from blogging, commenting, AND twittering... I just can't take the cattiness.

Peace. I'm out.

snoopys_snooper said...

So you are saying because someone is going through a rough time they can do whatever they want and not have to worry about the repercussions? If that is your opinion then fine... but it isn't mine.
It is a horrible thing she has gone through. I get that... But there are still consequences for actions. Timing is a bitch sometimes...
Do I hope she recovers from everything that is happened? Absolutely! Do I think she deserved what happened to Sawyer? Of course not. In no way, shape, or form. Do I feel bad about people commenting on her blog how they were? Hell no...

Peeved Michelle said...

Your comments page reads like a list of another 70 or so people who could use a punch in the face.

Carrie said...

To all of you bashing on Michelle-Shame on you!
Michelle is one of the nicest people I have met in a long time. She is one of the most amazing mothers and no she is not perfect, but who is. I do think this GINA person(I have never followed her blog) is a horrible attention seeking person. She says she can barely take care of her children, blah blah blah-but she has all the time in the world to blog and fight online. Really???? Really-who HATES their kids? I don't understand this and I have had depression after my second child.
I am really getting sick of people like GINA who whine and whine online.
To attack a mom who just lost her infant son is to me beyond horrible. It's one of the lowest things you can do! It's the lowest of the low. I hope this Gina girl and everyone else saying shit about Michelle feels like CRAP absolute CRAP.
I will state this again-Michelle is NOT A TROLL. She is one of the most amazing mom's and people I know.
SHAME ON ALL OF YOU!
Now-I know people who blog online who are actually published and this GINA person doesn't even compare to them.
GINA-GET OFF YOUR ASS and do somethin productive and quit tweeting, facebooking, ect. crap about Michelle!

~Carrie~

Carrie said...

WOW! People are saying Michelle shouldn't even conceived Sawyer? WOW! YOU PEOPLE ARE HORRIBLE!!!! PIECES OF SHIT!
WTF-who has the right to say that????

Michelle and her family are amazing people and little sadie is an amazing little girl who does deserve a sibling if her family so wants to give her one.



~Carrie~

Ms. RN said...

Dear 2cents, 50 cent, snoopys snooper: I'm sorry..how many times are you going to change your name? You obviously put 2 and 2 together to figure out that I was Michelle's sister. Congratulations. Now that you know who I am, why don't you share who you are? (I'm not holding my breath on that one). You say it's impossible to avoid her "keyboard diarrhea" because all she does is post on the computer all day. Well, I find it funny that apparently all you do is read her posts all day. If you don't like it, don't read it. Simple as that. But don't ever call into question her decision to have another child. What is so selfish about having so much love to give? She had no idea that her child had a congenital heart defect. She didn't know it until he died in her arms. Instead of constantly bashing her (because she obviously offended you in some way in the past for you to be acting this way), turn the other cheek, and try to at least have some sympathy--mother to mother. Can we just forget the past and focus on the fact that this woman is grieving the loss of her only son? Let's be human beings for God's sake.

snoopys_snooper said...

How can someone put 2 and 2 together and figure out you are her sister based on like one post? How is the fact I actually know Michelle so hard to fathom?

How is a mother who wants to have a homebirth selfish? Since she commented on that being selfish how is getting pregnant intentionally after being told you are high risk not selfish? Considering her standards and all... Nowhere did I say she knew Sawyer had a heart defect... I said she knew she was high risk prior to becoming pregnant.

I have plenty of sympathy for her losing her child. I just don't have sympathy about people coming on her blog telling her how wrong she was for her comments...

Carrie if you have never followed TFB's blog how on earth would you know if she is all attention seeking? Why exactly is it that you think TFB should feel bad? What is it she specifically said to Michelle that she should feel bad about? Do you even know what you are talking about? You are sick of people like her who complain online? Are you trying to tell me you don't "whine" online about stuff? Somehow I am very, very doubtful about that...

Michelle said...

@snooper - you can let it go or save face and be honest in your identity so that we can do us both a favor and avoid the shit out of each other in the "real world" - will she come forward folks? of course not.

snoopys_snooper said...

What is it I need to let go of exactly? And who I am makes no difference....

Ms. RN said...

Of course she won't come out and reveal her true self to us. Cowards never do. I guarantee that snoopy would never say any of this to Michelle's face. Funny how people seem to suddenly "grow a pair" (pardon the expression), when able to hide behind their computer. Oh, and I love that you "sympathize with Michelle for losing her child", then basically in the same breath, call her "a troll". Thanks snoopy, but I think Michelle's had just about all the "sympathy" she can handle from you.

snoopys_snooper said...

Guess what? Your sister would have done this shit regardless of what happened to her the past few months... Her grief is nothing but an excuse to use for doing so now. It's that simple. Boo freaking hoo some people came on here and said she was in the wrong... Get over it. What is so wrong with not feeling bad about that? Just because someone is greiving doesn't mean they can do whatever they want and not be held accountabile...

Michelle said...

@snoopy - why don't you tip off your friend to this and move the flamewar elsewhere.

http://itsabeautifulwreck.com/2010/08/turn-other-cheek-and-take-punch/

And for the record, it's "accountable"

Colleen The Doula said...

Michelle, you don't deserve this. This is out of control. PLEASE don't publish anymore comments. PlEASE just stop this. Delete them all, take them all down, I don't care, but please don't let them hurt you anymore.

This disgusts me beyond my limits. I'm with The Beautiful Wreck-- if TFB can delete it all and make it go away to save face, and no one here will be true about who they are, then this is nothing but a giant road rage of people flexing their internet muscles so they can feel powerful at your expense.

I'm tired of trying to argue with people point by point and saying the same things over and over again. Clearly the irrational mind can't understand the moderate, rational things I'm saying, so I'm done her. I've got your back, girl, but I need a break.

I can't take this anymore, and I can't stand it. DELETE IT!

Minnesota Mom said...

Snooper you really do not know what you are saying. You have no idea of the potential damage you are doing to another human being. Please just stop.

Myer Monster said...

OK FUCKING BITCHES LISTEN UP.

Have you considered for one fucking second that maybe Michelle reacted the way she did because of the context of things that are happening in her life!

So what we are no longer to have opinions here? Is she not allowed to dislike something that someone else wrote?

I read Michelle's blog, and I laughed, because I could tell that she wrote it just to get it off her chest and have a release.

I've never read the other blog, and I don't care. Michelle deserves some fucking respect because she is a kind, and caring person.

Have some fucking compassion for the grieving mother you fucking dicks.

snoopys_snooper said...

poor michelle, wrote something and got caught. people said you were wrong. so u try to blame the rant on grief. sorry. i call bullshit. you have always been an instigator and "internet bully" simple as that. i never met anyone who thrived on attention more than you... a full day of this is more than enough for me... most of the people who haven't known you for long will see it soon enough... plenty already have and just ignore you now...

Ms. RN said...

There goes snoopy...growing that pair of balls again. The ones we ALL know she wouldn't have if this were all taking place in "real life" and not on the internet. Wow...you are really intimidating. Please go get a job or hobby..you know, besides picking on a grieving mother

Kiki said...

Holy Sh*t! This is my first time here and wowzer... when did the damn Internet get so mean?

Michelle has lost her child. Her son died in her arms... I think that pretty much trumps anything and quite frankly, if your child dies in your arms the rest of the world should be A) compassionate enough and B)sane enough to give you a free pass for anything that is said that can be taken as "mean".

I'm so sorry for your loss Michelle... as the mother to a child born with a severe heart condition, but who is healthy today, you have nothing but my best wishes for a peaceful future.